“We’re Tough Love.” - A Most Memorable and Emotionally Driven Discussion with Vitriol 

December 4th, 2021

Passion. Uniqueness. Powerful sequences. Extreme Metal and music, certainly has it’s devastating way of creating such a profound impact. Throughout my near 2+ of listening to, and watching Vitriol live, I’ve come to truly connect to their most violent, piercing sounding Death Metal. The entire band talked with me at around 2:15 AM after their most successful headlining show at Supply & Demand in Long Beach, California. We talked about the downtime from Covid, how the two newest band members Stephen Ellis and Chason Westmoreland got into Vitriol, the emotional connect fans feel from the band, experiences and lessons from Erik Rutan himself, and much more. This was a fantastic and joyful interview, Vitriol is here to stay, and it’s just the beginning.

(The entire audio interview, and YouTube version, can be found at the bottom of the page)

Metalchondria:  This is Jason (Williams) of Metalchondria, here with Kyle Rasmussen, Stephen Ellis, Adam Roethlisberger, and Chason Westmoreland--

Adam Roethlisberger:  Damn!

Metalchondria:  I have a good memory.

Kyle Rasmussen:  I couldn't have done that, that quickly (laughs).

Metalchondria: (Smiles) I don't have a lot of qualities, my memory is one of them, so I'll take that to my bank.  A lot has changed like, in everything, you know?  I talked to you guys after the Vader show (February 2020), the tour with Krisiun (upcoming), all excited, and just a few weeks later, everything changed, you know?  So, just to talk about the time off only and that said, the one theory I'll say at least bands maybe that, all this time off, people can work their jobs more, maybe pay this off and this.  I'm hoping there was some kind of benefit having this much time off.  What was it like for the band in general, in terms of that, picking up new music again, anything just in general for the time off you guys had?

Kyle Rasmussen:  Yeah.  It was, I don't want to say it was "a blessing in disguise", I mean it was just, shock, you know?  Having your whole, especially coming off the tail of your debut album, and you have this great support lined up, so it was a drag.  But, with that being said, it was a great opportunity to get a head start on the second record.  I know we have fans that are really, and our label (laughs), that are very eager to see what we're doing next.  So, and we had so many great opportunities coming, that it was a double-edged sword, you know?  If we're busy touring for the next full year, then that's, you know, an extra year without a record.  We tried to, we weren't prepared mentally to start working on the new album so soon, but we didn't waste much time.  We knew what we were in for, and we knew we had to keep working, so we started toying on our way with that, and it's been a beautiful thing, man.  We're 9 out of 10 songs structured out, the next record.  That' something, yeah, we probably would maybe just be starting now, if that hadn't happened.  

     Between that, you know, just personal stuff, for all of us that were different.  I started a business, my job before, I was a body piercer.  So, with Covid, I couldn't obviously go back and do that.  So, I had to go work at a grocery store, or figure something out.  So, I started making spiked guitar straps.

     Stephen Ellis:  I went and worked at a grocery store.

     Kyle Rasmussen: (Laughs) You went and worked at a grocery store.

     Metalchondria:  That was my old job for 14 years, before my new job.

     Kyle Rasmussen:  Yeah?  Yeah, I did that, that's been cool.  Hard as shit, got real overwhelmed between the band and that, and Covid, got real depressed for a while, and you know, it's been a battle.  But, it's cool!  I feel like, we kicked Covid's, you know?  I feel good about it.

     Metalchondria:  I'm hoping we'll get back to some kind of normal, you know, until that point.  But, speaking of changes earlier, there's two new members of the band!  And, I like to ask how that kind of came to be, with this?  This lineup, as great as the shows were with Cattle (Decapitation) and Vader, I got to really see, I was talking earlier about the drumming of Chason, that a lot of the music can open up, it's just more that can happen!  So, I'm really curious about the changes, since you guys (Kyle and Adam) are the main stays of the band.  Tell me about the additions of Stephen and Chason, and how it came to be?

     Kyle Rasmussen: (Looks at Adam) You want to talk?

     Adam Roethlisberger:  Sure!  So yeah, Stephen goes way back with us.  Actually, on that Vader that we did, Stephen came out and did merch for us.  

     Stephen Ellis:  I was promoted!

     (Vitriol laughs)

     Adam Roethlisberger:  He's been, we lost our other guitar player (Mike Ashton), and we had short time.  We had Psycho Las Vegas coming up, earlier this year.  We played in August, and we were about six weeks out, and needed another guitar player.  Since we go back with Stephen, we all said, he'd come out and play some shows with us.  And, he kindly obliged.

     Kyle Rasmussen:  Stephen actually, if I can interject for a second, Stephen actually was one of the first guitar players, to formally audition for the band back in 2012.  When the very first EP came out, because we go way back.  And his playing just wasn't 'quite' there yet, but he had 10 years to (laugh), get there, and now he's fucking, now he's a lot better, a lot of shit than I am!  It's a really cool...you know, full circle story.  We were feeling it out.  He had another project; he was passionate about.  Ahh, I'm taking over now.  

     Stephen Ellis:  That was fun!

     Kyle Rasmussen:  You good?  (laughs)

     Metalchondria: (laughs) Y'all can speak!  Anyone can speak, of course, I want to hear from everyone, you know?

     Adam Roethlisberger:  So yeah, we took Stephen out, and we also had Pierce Williams from Skeletal Remains, help us out to do a couple of shows for the Psycho run.  But he's committed with those guys, so coming up on this tour we just did, we needed a drummer, in short time as well.  So, we reached out to Chason, a bad motherfucker, to come out with us assholes.  Yeah, master skinsman's been fucking crushing it, night after night.  And on short notice, too.  Yeah, here we are, man.  It's been a really successful tour, and everyone's gelling really well, and everything's going great!

     Metalchondria:  I was going to say, you go from the tour in the East Coast, then you come all the way here, you just don't know?  You know, how the turnout, you hope of course, but tonight, it was just so pleasing, it was great!

     Adam Roethlisberger:  It was sick!

     Kyle Rasmussen:  Oh yeah!

     Metalchondria:  It was great!  I loved it; you know for the band.  I want all of you to succeed, as much as possible.  So, how much did the Dying Fetus tour in terms of what you know, the merch, traffic online, or anything?  Did that really translate there, and over here if you noticed?  What were the real benefits of that tour for the band?

     Kyle Rasmussen:  I think Covid, did a lot to, not only develop a hunger in the fanbase for every band, you know?  Just listeners of music, because you cut 'em off from live music for almost two years, and a couple of things happen:  They're going to become "frenzied", and ready for some live music.  But then also, I like to believe, that it gave a lot of fans, of music, an opportunity to develop more intimate relationship, with the bands they like.  'Cause, a lot of us were stuck at home, hopefully listening to music in their headphones or whatever.  I mean, I could tell you right now between, I don't know if it's just the organic, evolution of the band's, you know, touring career, or if it had a lot to do with that downtime.  I mean, I'm seeing people shout the lyrics back at me.  That's something I haven't seen before, and it's every night, you know?  And it's like, that year and a half, two years, either did a lot to help people just get excited about the band, or the people that were excited about the band, dug deeper.  It's probably a little bit of both.  It's been great, man.  Were you at the last one?  Oh, no, we talked about that.

       Metalchondria:  I was at the San Diego Vader (show), and the LA Vader one.

       Kyle Rasmussen:  Well, if you saw us here last time.

       (Vitriol laughs)

       Metalchondria:  Couldn't.  (Laughs) Nope.

       Stephen Ellis:  Nobody saw us here last time!

       Kyle Rasmussen: (Laughs) Exactly!

       Metalchondria:  It was too late...

       Kyle Rasmussen:  It's cool, man. It feels great.  It feels great.  It feels like we didn't skip a beat.  And, yeah that's it, that's my answer.

       Stephen Ellis:  Lot of people coming out, saying it's their first show since Covid.  Lot of people coming out, just hyped, excited, talking about how much they love the show, how much they love being back out again, you know?  

       Adam Roethlisberger:  One of the things that I noticed, pre-Covid you know, the opening band for these bigger packages like Vader, and Cattle, people kind of walked in as we were playing.  And on this Dying Fetus run, most of everybody that showed up for the entire night, was there by the time we started.  And I think that shows, there's been a lot more interest in Vitriol.  And again, I think people are just starving for some fucking aggressive music.

       Kyle Rasmussen:  Yeah, I think it's both, definitely.

       Metalchondria:  And at least for me, with Covid and everything, one thing, I feel almost...I guess Metalheads, we learn things kind of maybe late, because there's so much detail, and so much musicianship, technicality and emotion, drumming has like, opened up more for me, than ever in my life.  Now, I hear songs drumming wise now, like more than ever.  So, when I hear Chason perform, I can hear the tempos...there's more of this manipulation of tempo, where I feel like certain parts, there's just more you can do.  Because, there's so much more going on.  I'm still learning and learning.  I guess, Jaime St. Merat of Ulcerate, over this year, I think it's arguably as good as it gets, just my personal opinion, on how great he is, and just opening up more of these details.  And, you said before that you mainly write the songs, but the band members would maybe, not write riffs, but change a tempo part, or maybe slow something, things like that.

      Kyle Rasmussen:  Yeah, or how...Adam's really good at is, thinking about a lot of ear candy, rhythmic ear candy or like, let's have one guitar pause here, and then you know, a lot of stuff that happens, that kind of inner play.  

      Adam Roethlisberger:  Dynamic.

      Kyle Rasmussen:  Between the, yeah, the dynamic inner play, between the instruments.  Adam has a great ear for that.  So, a lot of that stuff, when you hear a pan, or a moment of suspense, a caught breath or whatever, he's great.

      Metalchondria:  I think you mentioned before that you said, you were the director, and these are the ones who are also on the stage, working the stage, the director has the main concept of it, but you know, I just remember that detail really well.  So, I mention about the drumming, Chason, if you can chime in, at least from your vantage point from all the experience and bands, you've played for.  This is all a language for me, so I like to translate as best as I can.  From your standpoint, what is their music like, how they write, how they play, I guess I like to hear a drummer's perspective, of what they do.  I'm just curious, I guess.  It's an abstract comment or question, or theory I guess, but I'm just curious vantage point, what is their riffs, their style, what is it exactly?  From a drummer's perspective, I'm just curious.

     Chason Westmoreland:  What I feel when I first learned the tracks, was a really unrelenting kind of a thing, but with these tripped out parts.  There's like, it kind of reminds me like a really aggressive band, that's trying to pressure you, but then they want to flip that, in a way where there's like a pressure, but then the pressure changes and flips upside-down, almost to me.  Which is really fascinating.  There’re parts where, I'll have like a really open, let's say it's like a Blackened Death Metal part, but then something, I keep saying this, but something tripped out will happen.  There's a lot of curveballs, a lot.  And I think that was something that caught my attention, from the very beginning.  I just didn't know what was happening.  So that was (laughs), it was a growth as a player for me, to have to adapt to that.  But it's been fascinating to learn, and be integrated, into something like that.  Because, I didn't know what to expect.  Each song has a little something different in it, especially some middle sections of some of them.  So yeah, a dynamic canvas, that's for sure.  A lot of parts for me to do things that I would like to do, and these dudes are awesome enough to let me express, the way I like to.  So yeah, I think that's a good answer.  It's been a lot of curveballs that I've enjoyed.  Lots of tempo changes, and I wouldn't have thought of ever.  It's just been awesome to get used to them, and feel the flow live more now, because the tempo changes were like, hitting me so hard at the beginning, and I was like, "Oh my goodness!"  A lot of adjusting right at the last bit of a bar, to get to the tempo change.  

        Metalchondria:  See, that's the stuff I can listen to, and that's the stuff that just matters.  Those really important details, we know what it's like, what we listen to, our heroes, our veteran bands, and as musicians.  So that's the stuff I just like to, you know, hear about.  

        And you mentioned too, I talked about, brought in guitar, and you said, you wrote for the first album, you wrote all the guitar parts, played them all, and you said the right side or so, was pretty much the draft of the riffs, something I believe you said like that.

        Kyle Rasmussen:  Yeah, the left side was...I write all the songs with one side, as one side.  And when I track the other side, it was more or less, sort of improvised.

        Metalchondria:  Taking those guitar parts and working together, what is your experience as a guitar player with Kyle, in terms of how to play his vision, your own contributions of course, just overall I'd like to just hear more about the dynamic between both of you, guitar wise.

         Stephen Ellis:  Oh, from the first day, it's been very, very seamless, because we both have such an immense respect for each other as players, and as creative people.  They'll be lots of, you know, and I remember even like back when the first record was being made, we would be asked about different riffs and stuff.  Honestly, as far as learning the riffs go, it's been a real, it's sorting of like learning a different language, you know?  You learn how somebody else approaches the instrument, you learn how somebody else creates moments of suspense and tension, and grandiose heights, and then breaks them all down, you know?  It's been very exciting to work with these guys, on a professional level, because I get to kind of see things from their perspective, and I get to, little bits and pieces, I get to add my own little sprinkle of sauce on there, you know?  I really would like, when we get back to home, I really like to start tracking these guys, so we can really start moving forward, you know?

         Metalchondria:  Tracking as in for the new record, you mean?  Or just...

         Stephen Ellis:  Yeah.

         Metalchondria:  Okay.  I'm sorry, go ahead!

         Kyle Rasmussen:  What I like, what I think Stephen's presence has really...My approach to guitar, has always been, I've always prioritized the creative vision, the ambition of the vision, and then the emotive energy, over anything else.  So, I'm fine being slightly looser player, in terms of the scope of Technical Metal, right?  And I think Stephen, is a tighter player than I am, in the sense that he's, his right hand is more defined, so he kind of creates this bedrock, that allows me to be, to kind of writhe around on top of.  I think it keeps the sound, which Chason's drumming...It's funny that you mentioned something about a kind of element of transparency, and it's not the first time he's heard that.  And I've been thinking about that, what that is.  The first thing I noticed about Chason's drumming that was so special is, when you're playing Metal this extreme, you usually compromising speed for power, or you're compromising power for speed.  And this freak of fucking nature, doesn't have to compromise either of them.

        (Laughs)

        Kyle Rasmussen:  What that does is, is not just "cool", I mean it is that.  But the effect that it has, is like taking a compressor off of something, because he's able to--a lot of guys are blasting fast, (mimics light sounding blast beats).  So, it's kind of this wash, because the hits, the velocities are so similar.  So, it's just kind of this level playing field.  But when you have a guy that's actually hitting his drums, you get these shooting highs, and then you get the dissipation, of the reverberations of the drums, the cymbals, and the wash of the cymbals.  So, he's creating with his power, so much more explosive dynamic.  And that allows other things, that allows the drums to dominate, when they're dominating!  And then kind of fall back, when he has that, moments of restraint.  And I think what it does, it's, creates this environment, that the strings get to kind of...I don't want to say it creates the illusion of more transparency, but it's not like he's playing less fucking notes, you know what I mean?

       Metalchondria:  Less, is not in his vocabulary!

       Kyle Rasmussen:  So, it's not that, it's not that you're hearing more of the stuff that's going on, because he's not playing as much.  It's how he's playing it.  And it kind of creates, and plays a trick on the ear.  Things are kind of shuffling to the forefront, and then the drums are here, and then the guitar is here, and whatever.  So, between that, and how tight of a player...because every player has their strengths, but I would say Stephen is the tightest guitar player Vitriol has had.  With myself included.  That really, it's a very special glue between these guys.  I mean, even our A and R guy from our label was like, "That's maybe the best time I've seen you guys."  

      Metalchondria:  And you mentioned too about the styles, it's almost like...it'd be (Dave) Mustaine and (Marty) Friedman. Mustaine would be the more emotionally, fast picking solo parts, and you can tell Marty has that way, that he would bend--

       Stephen Ellis:  He's got the sauce!

       Kyle Rasmussen:  Right, that sauce.

       Metalchondria:  Right! So that's why I like to hear who's the more "emotional" player, and/or someone who's either more refined, the one with that a bit of it.  It's good to, I guess, hear the contrasts and everything.  

        And you're right, I think the band all the reps, the Dying Fetus (tour), and Covid, all these things, I feel like the band is getting this extra level of you know, time, playing in front of people, getting more time than ever because, I'm expecting that you're going to try to tour, as much as possible, permitted.

         Kyle Rasmussen:  That was always the plan.  We weren't going to stop, and the Covid happened, so...

         Stephen Ellis:  Wait, you guys weren't?  Aww...

         (laughs)  

         Kyle Rasmussen:  Got right back on the horse.

         Metalchondria:  And I was mentioning before that, it was announced this morning or yesterday, this amazing tour coming up in February.  #1, the band is actually not opening “opening” the bill, you move up a slot!  Because you mentioned before, trying to get out of that, even if the bill is really great, to try to get ahead on support.  So, Defeated Sanity and Skeletal Remains, I mean, I've never seen Defeated Sanity, so that's going to be a joy!

         Adam Roethlisberger:  You're in for a treat!

         Kyle Rasmussen:  Fucking amazing!

         Metalchondria:  I can't wait!  So how did that tour come about?

         Kyle Rasmussen:  Nothing too exciting.  Just, our manager was like, hey, this came across my desk, and basically you know...hey, would Vitriol be interested in this?  I don't know if it was their booking agent or what.  But when I heard Defeated Sanity, I was like, yeah!  I don't give a fuck who else is on the fucking tour, you know what I mean?  They're such a, profound inspiration to me.  Not necessarily like, obviously we don't sound anything like them, but as far as their approach and commitment to extreme music, their commitment to the underground, in terms of spirit, not in terms of, "Fuck success!"  I don't think that's what they're about, but you know, they're such a special band.  I mean, they brought this, concerned for the real like, everything is always dirty and filthy.  But it's coming from like top-tier level musicians, and it's like so fucking rare you get someone with a god-damned balls, to do that, you know what I mean?

         Metalchondria: (Lille) Gruber, the drummer, he played in Ingurgitating Oblivion's last record (2017 - Vision Wallows in Symphonies of Light, please hear this astonishing record), I don't know if you've heard that, years ago.

         Kyle Rasmussen:  I haven't.

         Metalchondria:  There's a 22-minute song on there, with his style of drumming.  It's on the same level I mentioned before like, Augury, Anata, Ulcerate.

         Stephen Ellis: (Laughs) Hell yeah!  Hell yeah.          

         Chason Westmoreland:  Anata! 

         Metalchondria:  I'm probably, the non-official spokesperson of that band, and I wish they would play here.  But, it's like Necrophagist, their album that was supposed to be, never came up, a record label thing.

          Kyle Rasmussen:  Same with Augury.

          Stephen Ellis:  They came out with a record; nobody gave a shit.

          Metalchondria:  Illusive Golden Age.

          Stephen Ellis:  They put out a record.

          Kyle Rasmussen:  What year?

          Metalchondria:  Two or three years ago?

          Stephen Ellis:  Yeah, like 2017, I feel like.  (2018)

          Kyle Rasmussen:  Did we listen to it?

          Adam Roethlisberger:  Yeah.

          Metalchondria:  Patrick's (Loisel) vocals are still amazing, but I feel like that album...it was like 9 years since Fragmentary Evidence. So, it still felt like they were still, getting used to each other.  The songs, they're not bad, but they're not the first 2 records.  And as a big fan, I can be objective.  It's not quite the same, but his vocals are arguably better than ever, though, still a positive.

           Kyle Rasmussen:  Fragmentary Evidence, oh my god.  That album blew me the fuck away.

           Metalchondria:  I told (Kyle) before, the three guys wrote 3 each of the songs, 3, 3, 3.  Patrick, Mathieu (Marcotte), and (Dominic) "Forest" (Lapointe) wrote 3, 3, and 3.  

           Kyle Rasmussen:  Amazing.  It's amazing that it flowed as well as it did, with that being said.  Cool!

           Metalchondria:  So yeah, that's the kind of stuff I'm really into, Ingurgitating (Oblivion), I put Vitriol in that group.  Again, it's uncomfortable, it's different, it's not the same, you know, "structures".  There is changes in the riffs, tempos manipulated constantly, so that's the stuff I'm just trying to learn about, and figure out, you know?

           Kyle Rasmussen:  Yeah, I mean, especially when you're implying high speed, or you want to keep the intensity on all the time.  Chason was commenting about the tempo changes.  If you know you want to be blasting most of the time, you have to create dynamics somewhere, if you don't want to just numb the listener.  And so, by making unpredictable tempo changes, by changing up how you're assaulting the person, you can do a lot to keep the listeners connected, to something that's just like, hammering you, non-stop.  

           Metalchondria:  I always find it fascinating, when a band that we particularly like, individually, like how you got there, "How did you hear about that band?" And, you'll never forget that moment or whatever it was.  I interviewed Kelly Shaefer of Atheist, and we talked about this and this, and he mentioned your former drummer (Scott Walker), and was like, "Oh, you got to hear that band!"  When I heard, it something musically, that came with me and emotionally.  I mention this because, over Covid, the band shows a lot of the tattoo work, that all these fans have.  It's not just a gimmick, they do the real thing, and they do more of it.  It's great to see people connect, in that way from the imagery, vocally, and lyrically, all that!  What do you believe people, the fans you've talked to, your experiences and your vibes in general, what do people gravitate towards Vitriol, what do you believe is something, whether the music itself, the imagery, the tattoo dedication on their skin forever?  What is it you feel that people really connect with that either you've been successful letting them know, or something brand new that I didn't know we connected in this way?

          Kyle Rasmusssen:  Thank you.  I'd say, I like to believe, and it's not just an assumption, I mean people say, even just tonight some guy came up and thanked me for the honesty, of the music.  And to me, that's always been, especially in a genre that's so, writhe with bravado, posturing, and lot of that, you know what I mean?  It's like being able to, I mean its hard music, but the music I make, comes from a place of vulnerability.  And, self-exposure.  While the music is caustic, and the message can seem superficially caustic, ultimately, I'd like to say Vitriol's voice is tough love.  We're tough love, you know what I mean?  Grant, we have some songs that are just about fucking murdering folks, and like, that's a good time.  But generally speaking, (pauses) it's about finding yourself through adversity, it's about value and suffering.  And, I think a lot of people out there, when you're living on hell on Earth, or something, let's say a rough home life, you're living in a rough neighborhood, or whatever, it's really hard to find value, or a why.  And I think Vitriol's message says, your conditions are unkind, but there's food there.  It allows you, for me, what I wanted to do for the fans, well, the message I wanted to put forth, was what the most important thing Heavy Metal gave to me growing up, which was, it made me feel strong in my suffering.  It made me feel as though that I wasn't suffering for nothing.  Through adversity, you become a better version of yourself.  

        And I think, a lot of people feel very, like I know "Victim", our song "Victim", is a consistently powerful one for our fans, because of the message, which is to not be one.  Even "(The) Parting of a Neck", its lyrics are much more figurative, but ultimately, I think a lot of people, pull out you know, destroying yourself to purify yourself.  And, I think when you talk about that, because it's real, the power of that's real.  If you're able to talk about that, especially from a place of experience, it can give people--I don't want to say hope, hope's the wrong word, but purpose, you know?  And feel like, you almost feel grateful for it, you know?  If you follow that road down far enough, you feel grateful for it, and then you start leaning into it, you know?  

        Adam Roethlisberger:  It's almost, assurance, in a way.

        (Fan comes up to Vitriol to say hi)

         "You guys fucking rule, thank you guys, thank you!"

         Kyle Rasmussen:  Have a good night, man.  Thank you so much!  Yeah, without waxing too far, I mean I'd say, it's that, we're trying to lift people up, you know?  I don't think that was really, I didn't think about that going into it.  I think more, you know, I made art music from a personal place, and it was to lift myself up, you know?  And not hide from the shit, and not hide from the truth, no matter how ugly it might be.  (Pauses) Hopefully our riffs are sick, you know? (laughs) 

         (Vitriol laughs)

          Kyle Rasmussen:  Hopefully the band's like that too!

          Stephen Ellis:  Yeah, hopefully people like us (laughs).

          Kyle Rasmussen:  But yeah man, one of the most powerful experiences I had, was on, I think it was the first tour, we played in Texas.  And there was a guy that was waiting by the merch booth all night to chat with me.  "Victim", particularly was the song that helped kick his Opiate addiction.  And as someone who has struggled with an Opiate addiction myself, I can't tell you...I left that show with level of purpose, I couldn't have imagined.  I couldn't believe that I could write a Death Metal song, that would be, provide that amount of wind in someone's sail, you know what I mean?  He was like, I listened to that song, and read those lyrics, and I just had this moment where I'm like, "Fuck, that's me, man.  I'm being a fucking victim, that's fucking me."  And if Vitriol can be that harsh, paternal, tough love of, "Hey motherfucker, you're a piece of shit.  But you don't have to be."  You know what I mean?  Because that was the conversation, I had with myself, right?  That's where it comes from, as I was for a very long, a person I didn't want to be.  And so, I kind of created this external voice through Vitriol, I always say that Vitriol is my dad.  He keeps me accountable; you know?  I project forth through Vitriol what I want to become, this ideal.  And then through performing the music, and interacting with the fans, I'm then held accountable to that standard.  And it's like, I can't fall beneath the standard of Vitriol, but then I also have to be careful of what I put out there, because I'm always held accountable (laughs), and this first album taught me that, you know?  You kind of become what you create, if you're doing it with integrity, hopefully, and you're not wanting to con the fans.  That's a long answer.

         Metalchondria:  No, that's what I like to hear!  Those are the self-reflection of things, that we grow together with.  And I guess I like this kind of particular genre of Metal, I call it Extreme.  That's what it like, Extreme Metal, Extreme music, because it takes you to that place as said where, uncomfortability, definitely feeling vulnerable, your worst moments, your greatest highs, and that knowing life is not fair.  Life is not given to you, you can work for it, and things can still not work out.  The point is, to keep doing what makes you get up that day.

         Kyle Rasmussen:  It's fight or die, man.  Fight or fucking die.

         Metalchondria:  And I believe within the passages, the structures, and how different the stuff is, I feel more at home with it.  It's more "normal" in a way, not just because I hear it so many times, but because I've been listening to this for so long, for 20 something, 25 years, you just kind of have an ear for it, and you grow.  It's like a puzzle, it opens up and opens up.  Certain parts of the songs tonight, I remember that part, that's when you just never stop learning.  I'd like to do for that, you know?

          Kyle Rasmussen:  Yeah, Vitriol, because it came from a place of love and dedication to the music, I mean, I went to my first Death Metal show when I was 13.  I'm 33, so 20 years I've been going to Death Metal shows, and loving Death Metal.  You develop the vocabulary, kind of what you're talking about, you describe it as putting the pieces of a puzzle together.  But I like to think of it as developing a vocabulary.  You know, especially if you're into other like, you're into Black Metal, Death Metal, whatever, then you can start creating the synthesis of these different languages, these cultural dialects, so to speak.  And if you reveal them and you respect them, and approach them with love and commitment, hopefully you can create a language that other people, such as yourself, that have love and appreciation for the music.  "I understand what you're saying!  Not only do I understand it, but that's awesome!  I'm so excited about it!"  And then you have these people that maybe don't have as robust of a vocabulary, and they see it and they're, blown away.

        Adam Roethlisberger:  "That was sick!"

        Kyle Rasmussen:  And that's the carrot at the end of the stick for them.  In that way, bit, onion.  Onion...

         (Adam laughs)

        Kyle Rasmussen: (Laughs) It's not irrelevant.  Vitriol is like this onion; you can peel away from.  And that was important to me, too.  I don't want to just alienate the more ground level.  For me, I got into Metal because I was an angry fucking kid, man!  I was real fucking angry, I'm still pretty fucking angry.  I'm working on it.  But, at the end of the fucking day, at the end of the fucking day, if you're a Death Metal, and I don't want to put my head through a fucking wall, or through my fucking enemy, then you're not doing your job.  And no matter how heady, and sophisticated our songwriting becomes, I never want to lose that primal connection, that will transcend all language, of the music or whatever.  That's someone who doesn't even know what Death Metal is, I want them to be able to come into a Vitriol show, and be like, "Oh, oh fuck, okay!  These guys don't want something good for me."  (laughs) Or whatever.  That's, and I'm very grateful that we seem to have maintained that intensity, through our musical journey.

        Metalchondria:  That's really, really well said.  And my last question, and again thank you all for your time very much, so the tour next year with Defeated Sanity, perfect world, doesn't exist but, Vitriol's perfect world for next year.  What would the band like to do?  Tour as much as possible, the new record, what's the plan, I guess?  What would you like to happen?

         Adam Roethlisberger:  One of the most exciting things for me to Europe, and doing a festival run.  Since I was a young kid, I had a couple of goals in mind, for what I wanted to accomplish through music, and over the years that always changes, because you always seem to want a little bit more, a little bit more.  But doing those giant festivals in Europe, has always been a bucket list item for me.  And I think it is for all of us, we're very excited to get over there, so we got a couple of festivals that we're looking to doing over the summer, and hopefully Covid doesn't shut things down.  We were supposed to do it the last two summers, and it keeps getting postponed, but eventually we're going to get over there, that's a really big highlight I'm looking forward to.

        Metalchondria:  Has the band been to Europe before?

        Adam Roethlisberger:  We've been to Europe once.  It was actually our very first tour with Nile and Hate Eternal, over there.  Our debut was supposed to come out a month later, but because we're going to do this tour, and it was happening in September, we actually got the pushed forward, so it was able to come out right at the beginning of that tour.  And that was our, that was Vitriol's very first tour, was over in Europe.

         Kyle Rasmussen:  It wasn't scary at all.  Not imitating at all.  To have your first tour with your musical heroes in a fucking foreign continent, you've never been to.  

         Adam Roethlisberger:  It was awesome! (laughs)

         Metalchondria:  Hate Eternal's actually going to play next week at the Metal and Beer fest in Los Angeles, I'm just going for Hate Eternal, honestly.  Converge is playing, some other bands, but to see Erik (Rutan) play, he hasn't played too often.  I know he's in Cannibal Corpse now, but still.  

         (Hate Eternal was replaced last minute, ended up not going.  God damn it.)

         Kyle Rasmussen:  I'd jump on any Hate Eternal performance you can.

         Metalchondria:  If he's playing guitar, you have to go, kind of thing, you know?

         Kyle Rasmussen:  That guy, man.  He's just the real deal.  I mean, there is no other, he's the fucking, that's a man whose work has inspired me.  He's maybe the best example of someone who, has not divorced himself from the heart of all of it, you know what I mean?  He understands why this music is made, and he connects with it every night.  I mean, I watched him every fucking night, and he was not performing, you know what I mean?  He wasn't performing, that was just his relationship with the music, right?  Because it comes from, very real and honest place.  Even if someone can't articulate that themselves, they can't look and be like, "Oh, I know why this is enigmatic, and so the gravity of this."  They might not know it, but they feel it.  You feel the gravity, you know?  And it's because it's fucking honest, you know?  Best Death Metal musician ever.

         Metalchondria: (To Chason) Do you have any quick comment about working with Rutan, when you were recording?  Was there anything that really memorable, or something that even helped you grow as a musician, person, drummer?

         Chason Westmoreland:  So many things.

         (Vitriol laughs)

         Kyle Rasmussen:  The whole time.

         Chason Westmoreland:  Spending hours and hours with Erik, after recording.  Just hanging out, I was where I learned the most.  In the studio, I kind of expected some of it, he got more out of me than I ever would have thought, but it was more so the after-studio hangs, that he taught me about being a professional.  Even musicality, we would talk about different things, so there's endless lessons to be learned from Erik, for real.  He's a great mentor.

         Kyle Rasmussen:  Such a kind, very kind (long pause).  I don't know if he'd appreciate this, tender, in his own way, you know?

         Chason Westmoreland:  Very much so!

         Kyle Rasmussen:  He’s molten lava and ice cold, you know what I'm saying?

         Metalchondria:  His album, you know his band, Alas, he did years and years ago.  Have you heard his project Alas?

         Kyle Rasmussen:  I feel like a poseur, I never even heard of it.

         Chason Westmoreland:  He showed me.

         Metalchondria:  It's the most, he said it was the most difficult thing he ever written.  It's like Classical, Melodic, Operatic Metal.  Okay, you want to talk about tender, it's called Absolute Purity, it was released in 1999 (Correction:  2001), right after Conquering the Throne.

          Kyle Rasmussen:  Wow!

          Chason Westmoreland:  The duality.

          Metalchondria:  Oh, my goodness.  The last song ("Longing for Destiny"), it's this Classical instrumental, with acoustic, it's on YouTube, you HAVE to find it.

           Kyle Rasmussen:  Oh, of course!

           Metalchondria:  I can't remember her name, she sang in Therion, she was, Martina (Hornbacher Astner, forgive me), I can't remember, but yeah.  It's tremendous.

            Kyle Rasmussen:  Thank you, I'm so excited to check it out.

            Metalchondria:  He said it was the most difficult thing he ever written, and you can hear some of the Rutan riffs, but the tones, how melodic and the operatic singing, it is a beauty.

            Kyle Rasmussen:  I'm so excited to check it out, thank you!

            Metalchondria:  It's an emotional album, it's sensational.  I'm happy to spread it.  If I ever get to interview him someday, he said that will happen again at some point.  It's been 20 years, so maybe not?  If he can do something like that again, it'd be tremendous.

            Any last words, couple of more days left, then back home, resting and recharging.  And then, a big tour for February/March, and I looked and I saw maybe 2-3 days off, I think.

            Kyle Rasmussen:  It's brutal (smiles).

            Metalchondria:  It should be well worth it.  Again, I'll be at the Anaheim Chain Reaction show.  There's a brewery literally, like 400 ft away from Chain Reaction.  Any last words you'd like to say for everyone listening, and going forward?

            Kyle Rasmussen:  This is always like the, options are limitless.

            Stephen Ellis:  Beans?  You like beans?  

            Metalchondria:  Refried?  Black Beans?

            (Kyle laughs)

            Stephen Ellis: Refried, baked, black beans, pinto, kidney, whatever you got, I'll fucking eat them!

             Chason Westmoreland:  Cannellini beans.

             Stephen Ellis:  Bean beans.

             (Band laughs)

             Kyle Rasmussen:  You heard it here, you heard it here first, folks!  Thank you to everyone who came out, on these 7 fucking weeks of madness.  The support has inspired us, and we can't wait to fucking do it again.  And again, and again, and again, and again!  

             Stephen Ellis:  This band is sponsored by Heinz tomato beans.